towards campaigning come summer, early fall, not tied up with this committee. the clock is ticking. hugo one of the essential reporters on the january 6th investigation. be sure to keep an eye on this stuff. follow him on twitter. thanks to all of you for getting up "way too early" with us on this thursday morning. "morning joe" starts right now. good morning, and welcome to "morning joe" on this thursday, march 31st. we've got a lot to get to this morning including the ignorance of vladimir putin. that's how u.s. officials are describing the russian leader as his advisors shield him from how badly the invasion is going. and despite vowing to scale back its offensive, russia is stepping up attacks near kyiv and other areas of the country. we're also following two big headlines out of the

entertainment industry. actor bruce willis steps away from acting because of a health condition and what chris rock said at his stand-up show last night about getting slapped onstage at the oscars in front of an international audience by will smith. as we said, a lot to get to. let's dive right in. u.s. intelligence officials determined vladimir putin is being misinformed by his advisers about russia's military struggles in ukraine. a u.s. official provided nbc news with declassified intelligence claiming there is persistent tension between putin and his ministry of defense. that's because some senior advisers "too afraid to tell him the truth" about russia's failures in ukraine. u.s. officials believe putin has been getting incomplete or overly optimistic reports about the status of russian troops, creating a mistrust between putin and his military leaders. officials told the "new york

times" the russian leader seemed genuinely unaware his military had been using conscripts in ukraine and drafted soldiers among those killed in action. they say putin's ignorance showed a clear breakdown in the flow of accurate information to the russian president. officials also said putin had an incomplete understanding about how damaging western sanctions had been on the russian economy. here's what some biden administration official hs to say yesterday. >> it -- understandably, would be an issue of concern if, for not just -- european allies and partners, certainly for ukraine if mr. putin is misinformed or uninformed about what's going on inside ukraine. it's his military. it's his war. he chose it. and so the fact that he may not

have all the context, that he may not fully understand that the degree to which his forces are failing in ukraine is a little discomforting. >> one of the achilles' heels of autocracies you don't have people in those system whose speak truth to power or have the ability to speak truth to power. i think that is something we're seeing in russia. >> willie, so many things going on here. first of all, u.s. officials telling the truth how badly misinformed vladimir putin is. that's one. two, of course, they're using psy-ops most likely on putin because somebody on the inside of vladimir putin's inner circle from the very beginning. remember, the leadup of the war and joe biden suggested this. leadup to the war, everybody saying russia wasn't going in. now the french intel officials, even zelenskyy saying they weren't going to go in. biden kept saying, he's going to invade.

he's planning to invade. u.s. officials -- we've called it every step of the way and done something extraordinary. so many extraordinary things have happened over the past month or so. one is, we are sharing our intel information, and now vladimir putin has to wake up in the west and read how ignorant he is about what's going on in his own war from our spokesman at the pentagon, from our secretary of state, from unnamed intel -- i mean, this has got to be driving this guy absolutely crazy. he's -- he's in the dark. he's being lied to by his own people and we're telling him about it. >> yeah. which only increases his isolation as he doesn't trust anyone around him anymore. tom donilon on last week, former national security adviser to president biden and said a guy in power 20 years only told exactly what he wants to be told, whose circle shrunk to the

few people he trusts anymore. no longer hears the truth. coming home to roost right now as he gets bad information or as you point out information from the united states. information from the uk. people who want to feed him the bad information to ruin his war effort. head of the uk's intelligence agency says russian troops are demoralized, disobeying orders. jeremy fleming, director of britain's surveillance agency spoke in australia how poorly the russian invasion is going. >> increasingly looks like putin has massively misjudged the situation. it's clear he's misjudged the resistance of the ukrainian people. he underestimated strength of the coalition his actions would galvanized. he underplayed the economic consequences of the sanctions regime. and he overestimated the abilities of his military to secure a rapid victory.

we've seen russian soldiers short of weapons and morale refuing to carry out orders. sabotaging their own equipment and even accidentally shooting down their own aircraft. even though we believe putin's advisers are afraid to tell him the truth, what's going on and the extent of these misjudgments must be crystal clear to the regime. >> with all that said, russia's assault continues across ukraine. ukrainian officials saying russian forces yesterday stepped up attacks again around the capital of kyiv and the northern city of chernihiv. two places russians said they would "drastically reduce" their attacks. hard-hit city of irpin, emergency service workers collecting dead bodies as the blasts continue. in chernihiv the governor says russian strikes destroyed homes as well as libraries and shopping centers. according to the pentagon, some

russian troops were moving away from the two cities heading towards neighboring belarus to regroup and move on to their next assignment. pentagon calling this a repositioning, not a withdrawal warning the kremlin plans to refit troops and probably employ them elsewhere in ukraine. local officials say at least one person is dead, three others injured after russian strikes hit civilians in kharkiv. ukraine's second largest city. fierce fighting also in donetsk in the east and around the besieged city of mariupol. joe, why we were talking about yesterday, there is no trust in these negotiations. yes, came to the table for a few hours in turkey, but as president zelenskyy pointed out again and again, we look at pictures, they say they're pulling back, they, in fact, step up and attack again. >> because there's a disconnect. there's a disconnect between the people who are negotiating, who feel like they're making good

progress, and vladimir putin himself. this guy is isolated. the few people he has around him are lying to him. so, yeah. we're going to see this for quite some time until this flow of information becomes less corrupted. >> bring in u.s. national editor at the financial times. ed loos, senior fellow at atlantic council, former deputy sec def in the buff administration, ian brzezinski and staff writer at the "atlantic." thanks for being with us. >> ed, i want to read some of the lines from the "new york times" article that obviously this news being spread across the west and pck up by vladimir putin. putin of russia misinformed by adviser, secretary of state antony blinken given less than truthful information from

adviser. tisk, tisking not getting served well. one of thetocraies you don't ha people speaking truth to power. and the pentagon not fully informed by his ministry of defense. he may not fully understand the degree to which his forces are failing in ukraine. the "times" writes mr. putin's ignorance shows a clear breakdown of flow of accurate information going to the russian president. the united states has been dead-on as far as their intel from the very beginning. and putin knows it. he's -- he's -- this as far as psy-ops goes, this is pretty extraordinary. this guy has got to be, becoming even more enraged by the fact that you've got the pentagon spokesperson, you've got the secretary of state saying, poor vlad. being lied to by his closest aides and too ignorant to know it. >> yeah.

this is really spectacular trolling that's going on. i mean, we're messing with putin's head here. and i mean, hard to miss the sort of adamant of, almost pleasure on john kirby the pentagon spokesman's face when he said it must be really hard for putin because he's getting bad information. so the shoe, after many years of russian misinformation, disinformation, in the west, the shoe is very much on the other foot. clearly there is some shoiden freuder to be had pointing out to putin he's not getting accurate information barks you people are too scared to give him accurate information. i mean, that's saying something quite strong, but, second, to clearly have the intention with these coordinated leaks, not just from the u.s. but from britain. not leaks. briefings of realtime intelligence with the intention

further deepening putin's mistrust of these people, where are the western intelligence agencies getting this information from? who are the molls in the operation? so the messing with putin's head operation is in full force and it's -- it's quite novel to watch. it's quite interesting to see. >> obviously, you bring up a great point. certainly no mistake you had u.s. officials saying what they were saying from the pentagon. now you had britain's official talking in australia. yeah. very coordinated by the west, and anne applebaum a man whose legacy built on lies, power built on lies now undermined by the lies all around him. >> yes. actually one of the basis of putin's regime is his ability to

confuse russians to build cynicism and apathy by convincing people that not only that they don't know what's true but can never know what's true. there's no truth available. they don't want anybody to find anything out. the u.s. i think by having used its intelligence before the war, by the way, almost nobody believed at the time. you know, in order to warn people, to illustrate what was going to happen and having been proved right, now has that credibility perhaps even in russia and in russia's inner circle in putin's inner circle that it didn't have before. one of the best responses to the russian style disinformation, which involved this kind of firehood of falsehoods telling lie after lie after lie is show something authentic, have a different and better story, and that's what the u.s. is trying to provide. >> yeah. so ian, interesting. even in the negotiations, you

have american officials who don't trust the negotiations. they think buying more time, but there's another explanation for it, too. yes. they're leaving parts of kyiv, they're withdrawing from parts of chernobyl in part because it's a retreat, but they're trying to wrap even retreat from these areas as a give and something the u.s. and ukrainians just aren't buying. >> i'm cautious calling it a russian retreat. kirby uses the right word. repositioning. marginal elements of russian forces pulling back from the north. probably really repositioning to reset themselves, to resupply themselves. to rest. possibly redeploy. we need to see more action on the ground. in fact, just add regarding putin's level of information. he's falling into an information, autocracy trap basically isolated himself from

russian society. both protective blanket of intelligence security forces around him. that blanket now is only protecting him, is petrified of him and one willing to tell him what he doesn't want to hear. they're exploiting that here. messing with his head and the confidence that establishment has, in putin's ability to lead. maybe beginning to see first signs of a serious strategic campaign undertaken by the west that's long overdue. >> yeah. long overdue. again, what's so interesting is, russians have been spreading lies and misinformation in the west obviously, for a century, but especially over the past fib five years and ill useful idiots in the west repeating those lies wherever they can. it's actually the truth our intel community is getting out. truth about a coming invasion,

that all of putin's useful idiots in america and in the west, all of putin's useful idiots in russia kept denying would ever happen. our intel community right time and time again. underlined by lies we're calling him out with truths. willie, there are parallels here, too. talked about it before. one of the reasons why you had the problem, the russians -- can you show -- >> okay. pictures of vladimir putin. >> come on poony know -- >> mesmerized by that collage of photographs. >> it was the goggles. >> trying to talk about stalin in june of 1941. one of the reasons that -- i can't do that with the goggles. one of the reasons that historians say the germans were able to sweep across russia as

quickly as they were, because, of course, stalin had his show trials and had purges from the early '30s all the way through, you know, the end of the '30s into '40, '41 and continued to get rid of anybody he considered to be a source of power. a challenge to his power. we've seen that with vladimir putin as well. and so this is, as ian said, this is a problem with autocracies. you end up being lied to. i remember a story, reading history, a story when some of his advisers were showing stalin a map of europe, they talked about the netherlands and germany moving on the netherlands and he said, what about holland? when did they go into holland? and everybody just sat there and said -- very good question. very good question. >> right. >> and that is, that is where vladimir putin finds himself right now and it's one of the

reasons why russians are getting just -- ground troops are just getting caught in this quagmire that he's completely ignorant of or at least was. >> and completely humiliated in front of the world. not just by effort of his military now his own ignorance what he knows and doesn't know about his own country and war effort. ed loos, leads to my question to you, which is, as this humiliation of vladimir putin grows by the day and learn more how isolated and poorly the invasion is going for the russian troops. albeit devastating for the ukrainian people, what does that tell us where he may go next? if he's really a man alone, scares a lot of foreign policy and military experts? >> it does. of course, the chemical weapons conversation's going to keep recurring as putin the back is to the wall, but we do have sporadic negotiations going on

between ukrainians and russians. most recently in turkey. there again, confusion what russia's negotiating position is and contradictory statements from, for example, lavrov, russia's foreign ministry, foreign minister and peskov, the kremlin spokesman about what russia's aims are keying back into what we've been talking ak. what are putin's orders? who is prepared to collar phi what his red lines and bottom lines are? clearly to judge by the very mixed range of signals coming out of russian negotiating teams, there isn't clarity fri from putin. putin's head is in a confused space. i strongly underline what ian said, and anne, that a strategic communications offensive may be we're seeing beginning of it, long overdue.

>> well, and at the same time it's safe to say i think given brutality what we're seeing in ukraine, putin being embarrassed, or misled, may not necessarily be a good outcome. this could make things even more dangerous, and i want to get to anne applebaum's article in just a moment. ian, give us a sense how much pressure is encircling vladimir putin on the map right now? what is nato doing versus the allied nations? are there more tools in the toolbox? >> well, allies is, you know, sustaining a fairly severe set of economic sanctions, and providing a good amount of military equipment to the ukrainians. but it's ultimately instuff because putin's continuing to drive on. we need to expand those economic sanctions making a comprehensive

trade embargo, particularly cutting off oil and gas. adds billions to the russian treasury to finance this war. we need to accelerate the supply of military equipment to the ukrainians. they're using up ammunition quickly and stock of anti-tank weapons very quickly. that supply has to be accelerated, and probably should be moving to new levels of security assistance to ukraine. providing for offensive punch. perhaps anti-ship missiles. aircraft. maybe even tanks, and armored personnel carriers we have in inventories to enable ukrainians not only to defend themselves but push the russians out. those are two areas that are of urgent concern and urgent necessity. >> anne applebaum, tell us about your article that really makes the point at this point there is no liberal world order, and this piece that you have for the "atlantic" and how it plays into

the overall pressure campaign against vladimir putin? >> this has been a long time. unspoken assumption among many western leaders rules in the world people more or less would obey and other nations would respect the wars of other nations most of the time, except maybe in the case of a few rogue states. certainly europe was, there were rules ap human rights. rules about behavior of states with others that everyone respected. all of that, of course, based on a kind of mythology that did hold all of those together for a number of decades after the second world war. what putin's war has shown us, without backing of that ideology or without backing of that mythology, sorry. without a -- without a willingness to defend it and without tools to defend it, it's

pretty meaningless. putin has just in the space of the last month, has defied all kinds of things that we thought were rules. crossing a border, committing mass human rights violations. he's deporting ukrainians to russia. this is a genuine echo of an old soviet policy that we thought was consigned to the stalin era. he's forcibly deporting people. he's committing, you know, openly using weapons against civilians. and we have to understand that these rules that we created about behavior of states particularly in europe and particularly in the post-war world aren't going to mean anything if we aren't willing to defend them. a military defense, ian talking about defending ukraine. also need to think about defending other states. also there's a, there's a strategic communications

defense. there's a kleptocracy defense. keep them from misusing our financial system and even an energy defense. not just time for climate change but weaken the autocracying around the world, it's important to move away from fossil fuels so we aren't dependent on them for our own energy. >> ed loos, anne's points that she brings up so critical now, and, of course, a follow to her extremely important book on authoritarianism versus democracy, the twilight of democracy, but haven't we seen -- first of all, let's just, again, looking at russia. this is what vladimir putin has done. what he's done in grozny, what he's done in, done in aleppo. what he's doing in mariupol. what russians have been doing for years, what the soviets did,

what stalin did. the question is what is the liberal order's response to that? ed, i must say, i'm -- i'm stunned as i'm sure you are, too, by how much some of our more reluctant allies in europe have moved to, to put together a bull wart against this type activity. germany, finland, sweden, even switzerland, who stayed nude neutral in the second world war. we've seen great movement over the past four to six weeks in europe to the likes we could no have even imagined two weeks ago? >> in four to six weeks decades have happened. this weekend elections in hungary, where victor oleban looks like with a really manipulated scene, looks like he'll get back to power for the

fourth time. hungary's strong man. putin's closest friend within nato. let's not forget. a country that, although it's a nato member, is not permitting the transshipment of arms into ukraine. it borders ukraine, and also an election in serbia. russia's traditional little brother in europe. again, run by a strong man, and likely to be re-elected. anne's broader point about the fact that we can't enforce the international order is well taken. i think that the test here is actually with china. china has a no-limits friendship. xi jinping a no-limits friendship with putin, but china is very stuck on territorial integrity and countries basically not invading other countries. that's been its position for a long time, and the longer this war goes on, and the more we get into the aleppo, grozny kind of

ghastliness, the tougher stick the chinese will find themselves in. tougher a bind, and so their response is really dewhat anne is talking about. >> hmm. >> of course, never forget as far as orban goes, putin's closest friend in nato. a man who hates liberal democracy and said as much. so-called conservatives used to pretend to be conservatives have now taken up their cause with victor orbon and to sit there and parrot when he believes in his hayes trid of liberal democracy, hatred for a free press, hatred for diversity. his hatred for immigration. his hatred for the very things that have made this country so

extraordinary, and the very thing that vladimir putin doesn't have right now. he doesn't have descenting voices and why he's being lied to. why his army's being destroyed in the battlefield by a fierce ukrainian resistance, and that's why he's looking like a fool in front of the whole world. i hope these so-called conservatives enjoy the money they're making, because they've sold their souls. >> lies catch up. may take a while, but they catch up. ian brzezinski, ed loos, anne applebaum, thank you very much for being on this morning. still ahead on "morning joe" joined by nato's secretary-general to talk about the ongoing international response to the russian invasion of ukraine. plus -- comedian chris rock returns to the stand-up stage in his first public appearance since the slap at the oscar stage by will smith. we'll tell you what he said about it, and bruce willis

stepping away from the big screen. we'll talk to a health expert about the neurological condition, the legendary actor has been diagnosed with. a lot ahead as our continuing coverage of the russian invasion of ukraine. we'll be right back. we're hoping things will pick up by q3. yeah...uhhh... [children laughing] doug? [ding] never settle with power e*trade. it has easy-to-use tools and some of the lowest prices. get e*trade and start trading today. this is the new world of work. each day looks different than the last. but whatever work becomes, the servicenow platform will make it just, flow. whether it's finding new ways to help you serve your customers, orchestrating a safe return to the office...

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. bruce willis, iconic star of the "die hard" franchise and dozens of other action films step pg way from acting. the news shared by his familying a being diagnosed with aphasia. impacting the ability to communicate. stephanie gosk has details. >> i'm thirsty. >> reporter: few actors deliver a line like bruce willis deliver as line. >> welcome to the party, pal! >> reporter: the star behind

some of the big of the blockbusters in the late '80s and '90s. >> where did you get this motorcycle? >> it's not a motorcycle, baby. it's a chopper. >> reporter: stepping back from acting over his health. recently diagnosed with aphasia, impacting cognitive abilities going on to say it's a really challenging time for our family and we are appreciative of your continued love. it's a result of damage to the brain responsible for language and can affect all aspects of communication including speaking and understanding. >> definitely two ways to look at aphasia, acute, happens because of a stroke and aggressive aphasia happens because of dementia involved of those over age 55. >> reporter: as bruce always says, "live it up," and together

we plan to do just that. yippie-ki-yay. >> a reference to a line in "die hard." nbc's stephanie gosk reporting. talk more about aphasia. dr. emily, thanks for being with us. a sense of what aphasia is in that piece. broaden it out. what might bruce willis or a patient suffering from aphasia say at his age even be going through right now? >> good morning. thanks so much for having me. amasha is a broad term and a term that affects approximately 2 million americans. kind of a catchall term for anyone who has difficulty either understanding or producing speech. we think of aphasia, six different types. first, a fluent aphasia. in that case the patient is able to produce language, but more like word salad. you can't understand what they're saying and they don't really know what they're saying.

in the case of the next type, it's an aphasia patients understand what you're saying but cannot produce speech. several other types of aphasia including a global aphasia, which is a combination of understanding and ability to speak. finally, a type of aphasia progressive primary aphasia connected with the frontal section progressive over time, begins with difficulty producing an understanding language. later has cognitive deficits similar to those of alzheimer's. >> interesting. the family didn't make clear which of those it is, but i guess the question a lot of people wonder about right now is, is there recovery from afage hsia? treatment of this, a way to get better for a patient who's suffering from it? >> depends a little on the type of aphasia. most common cause in the u.s. is

a stroke. second being a traumatic brain injury. with both strokes and dramatic brain injuries dependent on the extent of the damage. some of the swelling in the brain goes down, and patients participate in therapy, there is chance of significant recovery. the other thing to mention about aphasia is that as i said, the most common cause is a stroke. all heard the american stroke association talks about f.a.s.t. face, arms -- language and time. we want to get people to the hospital quickly developing new onset aphasia. we have things to help with that. in the setting of progressive aphasia, we can't reverse that. that is due to deterioration of the brain similar to that in alzheimer's disease. we can have a hope to minimize

symptoms getting patients involved in speech, cognitive therapy working with specific therapists trained to deal with aphasia. >> certainly hoping for the very best for him. he's brought so many so much joy over the year. >> he has. >> director of neurotrauma and people talking about "die hard." kid of the '80s, "the" movie. "the sixth sense." "pulp fiction." the list goes on and on and on. he's an icon. a term thrown around too much, bud bruce willis is an icon. >> he is. and what is driving a red hot housing market? we talk about that ahead on "morning joe."

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welcome back to "morning joe." you see the lights on down in, i think that's the east room. probably have secretaries of different agencies with headphones on. headsets on listening to russians talking to vladimir putin right now to tell him exactly what they said to him this afternoon and know whether they're telling the truth. >> okay. >> or a lie. not easy to be putin right now. being lied to by everybody that's around you, and, but he still continues his actions as a war criminal. at some point, at some point, you may start getting the truth from the front lines and they may understand that he's already lost this war. the u.s. is sending in additional $500 million of aid to ukraine. white house announced the move yesterday following a 55-minute

phone call between president joe biden and ukraine president zelenskyy. the white house says, the two leaders discussed how the united states is working around the clock to fulfill the main security assistance requests by ukraine. bring in right now host of "way too early" and white house bureau chief at politico. had that position since 1957, when politico needed to bring on somebody that played golf with dwight eisenhower. worked out splendidly since. jonathan lemire. thanks for being here. what do you know? >> president zelenskyy calling for a no-fly zone what the united states and nato unwilling to provide for fear how it will escalate the conflict. he's backed off of that to a degree. according to officials that talked to me about this they need more weapons and money for weapons. more supplies. there is concern.

ukrainian military had such success repelling russian advances and even stage counterattacks particularly near kyiv but running out of weapons. >> jojonathan, can i ask you? the russian army is on the run in many parts of ukraine. so you would think that americans and nato allies wouldn't have to be called for these sort of requests? you would think that the pentagon would be saying, my god, you know, we can drive the russians completely out of ukraine. why is it he's always having to ask for more ammunition, more weapons? why is he having to ask for tanks? i understand the debate about planes, even though i think he should get the planes. why is he asking to ask for anti-ship weapons? why is it? is it the lawyers? i'm told by people behind the scenes there are lawyers in every department saying you can't do that, you have to do that. what's going on? why does he have to keep asking these questions when it should

be the united states and nato allies that are just rushing to say, please, please, can you, please, take some more weapons? some more defensive weapons? why aren't they doing that? >> yeah. some bureaucracy at play. you hit on that. the pentagon rebut, we have been sending a steady flow of weapons but they clearly need more. it's an expectations game. talked about it yesterday. not just putin misjudged strength of his own army. so did the united states. they misjudged the strength of putin's army. initially the weapons went to ukraine were to be more, insurgency. a shorter-term conflict because most officials didn't believe russia would have success, and maybe even make their way to kyiv within a matter of days. now that the ukraine forces have done so well, prolonged conflict. we're on to its second month. they need more. their asks increased for good

reasons and for good news. they're having such success. the reason they need more munitions and the idea of intelligence, extraordinary step to release intelligence yesterday saying putin was getting bad information from his own generals. part of that continuing the strategy the u.s. did before the war. part of it is just to plant more seeds of doubt. they believe putin is particularly vulnerable to questions about the intelligence agencies. an ex kgb officer himself. inner circle not generals rather intelligence agencies. administration officials say that's what they want to do here. even if not entirely true, they want putin to think perhaps it is true. that it is indeed the psychological ops game being played. >> psy-ops, maybe we don't know? u.s. intel agencies right along

along. predicting this when other countries say, no, no, no. he's not going in. and willie, quick question. why did dwight eisenhower stop playing golf with lemire? happened summer of '58. you remember why? >> no. >> no. >> well, ike used to people giving him gimmes. five-foot gimmes. lemire within three feet pap boston guy. sorry. you have to putt that in. i've had enough. >> having been in business long as he's been in it, lemire looks great. just say. in his late 70s. had a lot of work done clearly. >> botox. >> yeah. >> a lot are work. >> holding up well. >> and second covid booster shot. yeah. look, i told -- >> we know you're not -- >> saw a clip of the immediate former president claiming to have a hole in one this weekend. each time that president trump put out a statement about it

force of the wind is only increased. went from a mild breeze, category 1 hurricane. ike and i play in similar conditions and approaching windmill. mr. president, can't just have it. have to earn. >> ahead on "morning joe." talk about the first fan. biggest fan. willie! did you see it? former president -- >> no, no. i just -- nope. don't care. >> once again brought up ratings. we thank him for that. again, we just finished another quarter. thanks to the hard workers behind the cameras, actually. number two show and in all of cable. in all of cable. just -- that hadn't started happening until this year. like, we're beating the home shopping network. we're beating -- your -- your -- else what are we beating? what other cable channel? tnt.

ah -- espn. home and garden network. you know? my favorite channel qvc. all of them. all of them. >> part of your mission statement 15 years ago. said one day we will be bigger than the home shopping network, and it finally happened. >> one day. >> we're not. >> nice of the former president to try not to read all of my personal statements from santy but nice to shine a spotlight on our great staff wakes up middle of the night to have second highest rates television program in all of table again. so thank you, mr. president. >> and can't tweet anymore. ahead on "morning joe." >> do we have a camera of the room? >> no. >> of the control room. >> just not -- >> used to always go -- come on, not really the time for it. >> don't be difficulty. budget cuts? let's see it. >> cut you off the show here. ahead on "morning joe." >> not going to show it. >> how espionage played into the war on ukraine.

talking to a veteran of the cia, plus nato's secretary-general our guest. chris rock speaks out after being slapped by will smith at the oscars. what he said last crowned oscar winner might face for his violent outburst. >> for beating up somebody on stage. then he got a standing ovation, by the way. >> "morning joe." >> way to go, hollywood. way to go, academy.

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you know, willie, what a beautiful shot of the capitol. 6:54 a.m. time to get up and get ready for work. willie, when i started scarborough country, you know what year that was, '47, after the war, we started our band, right after the war, and my kids, i guess they were excited

dad was on tv or something like that, you know, not being walked to jail or anything, but one of my kids would call me like at 8:59 every night and he would like -- i'm like -- i would start at 9:00, 8:59, i said to my child, hey, listen, you know i start the show at 9:00, can you call me five minutes before, maybe, i see you right after, tuck you in bed, and so we got past that, but, you know, there's like life is -- what is it? a perfect circle. now i'm dealing with elderly calling me all these years later during the middle of the show. richard haas, he's face timing in the middle show. richard knows i'm on the show. >> i was wondering who that was. >> face timing me in the middle of the show. do we need to take grandpa's phone away. >> do you face time? >> i don't face time richard. >> elderly comments we call that the full giuliani, sitting on your phone in the middle of the night and calling people,

reporters usually, to have a chat. maybe that's what happened with richard. >> we'll give him the benefit of the doubt. we want to let richard come on the show, okay, not only because he knows a thing or two about foreign policy, but claims to know a good bit about golf. so we want -- but i just don't know if we need to do an intervention or not. >> oh, lord. >> maybe we should talk to him off-line. give him a pass here. >> you say there's not -- probably a pocket dial of some kind. >> yeah. >> you're saying this is the -- not the arena to do it. >> no, it's not. >> we are going to continue our coverage of the russian invasion of ukraine. we have the secretary general, nato secretary general, jens stoltenberg joining us, former u.s. ambassador joining us later in the show and alexander vinman. right now let's bring in someone who never misdials -- >> whoa. i don't know.

>> former treasury official -- >> calls me at some strange times of the night talking about charts. >> steve ratner. >> all right. parent, wake your kids up. they've been asking you, mom, mom, help me out here. >> yeah. >> what are interest rates going to do to mortgages and growth pattern -- >> actually, what's going on with the housing market? >> so here you are, the kids ask for it, ratner, here you are, giving us the answers. what do you got? >> ready to perform on demand, joe, as always, and mental note, do not face time you between 6:00 and 9:00 eastern. won't happen from me anyway. >> all right. >> i can't tell you where interest rates are going but i can show you where they have been coming from, which is, a low-level to a higher level n last three weeks we've had a substantial rise in interest rates. they've gone from $3.75% to 4.5%. see how steeply the pink line has gone up.

that's the fastest increase in mortgage rates since 1987. they're still at a low level compared to where they were before the financial crisis, but they are still trending up and this is all a part of the inflationary pressures we're feeling, the fed having to raise interest rates, and all of that is obviously not good for people who are trying to buy or refinance the house. if you bought a typical $350,000 house, your interest rate payments would go from $1,180 to $2400 a month on the three-week increase in interest rates. we can turn to the housing market, if you're trying to buy a house, life is not better for you. you can see on the left house prices after having remained quite stable for a good while, have shot up. we just had a report this week, they're up 19% year over year, and they were up 11% last year. you put that together the average price in this country has gone from $270,000 to

$350,000, in just the last two years. if you look apt -- >> can i ask you about that, steve. >> sure. >> it was early on when the housing market got so hot a lot of people, myself included, were saying this reminds me of 2007, going into 2008, everybody was buying new houses, everybody was buying a second house a condo, extensions on their kitchens. you and many other people pointed out, this is cash. like people aren't extending themselves as you've always said $2 trillion placed on the sidelines during covid, people have a lot of money to spend. my question is, even with interest rates going up, do we expect this housing market to -- when is it going to cool down and when is there going to be sort of a return to normal for housing? >> not soon, joe, because your point is right there is a lot of cash still on the sidelines.

we have a real shortage of housing in this country. what happened after 2008 was that we simply didn't build enough houses for a long time and the housing industry was on its butt, frankly. we are by most estimates 3 to 4 million houses short in this country and as long as people have the money, as we talked about they do, as long as interest rates stay low, which at the moment they still are, people are going to keep buying houses. i'm going to show you in a second amazing statistics on that. in terms of -- can we just go back. okay. want to go there. i was going to go back one and show you the number of homes for sale is at an all-time low and half of all houses sold today are sold above the asking price. look, even if you're not a home buyer, a home renter, life is not so great for you. a third of the country are home renters and we've had this enormous escalation in rental prices. for a long time they were stable going up at 4% a year.

but now they're going up at 15% a year. life is not so much better if you're a better. your rent has gone from roughly $1600 a month to $1900 a month. so sure, there are people who own houses. you're in good shape. people who want to sell houses, you're in good shape. people going into the housing market or want to get another house, you're going to pay a lot more both for the house, the mortgage and if you're a renter for that rental apartment. >> is that ever going to stabilize or go back down, steve in. >> at some point, sure. this all moves in cycles and we're in an inflection point. you have interest rates going up, which would usually bring house prices down or keep them from going up so much, but as joe pointed out you have a lot of cash on the sidelines and trz are still relatively low compared to history, so that's not going to happen for a while. we have this housing shortage, and yes, home building has

picked up, but so has the cost of building a house. you've had these enormous increases in lumber prices, copper prices for your electrical wires and plumbing, so house prices are going to continue to go up. when you look at the polls about people's -- how they feel about their financial situation, it's obviously not good. the polls on the economy, on their own personal financial situation have gotten worse and this housing situation no doubt, is playing a piece in that. >> steve ratner, thank you very much for joining us this morning. >> thank you. two minutes past the top of the hour, u.s. intelligence officials have determined vladimir putin is being misinformed by his advisers about russia's military struggles in ukraine. >> it's enough to like make you want to put on going toles. >> -- put on goggles. >> declassified intelligence claiming there is persistent tension between putin and his

ministry of defense. >> do we have the goggles picture? >> some senior advisors are too afraid to tell him the truth about russia's failures in ukraine. u.s. officials believe putin has been getting incomplete or overly optimistic reports about the status of russian troops, creating a mistrust between putin and his military leaders. officials told "the new york times" the russian leader seemed genuinely unaware that his military had been using conscripts in ukraine and that drafted soldiers were among those killed in action. >> these are basic things. i'm thinking, if you are a dictator or a tyrant running a country, these are basic things you should know about. >> yeah. >> i still don't see the gogel picture. >> ignorance showed a, quote, clear breakdown in the flow of accurate information to the russian president. officials also said putin had incomplete understandings about how damaging western sanctions

had been. >> okay. >> to the russian economy. >> willie, here's a picture. >> maybe that's what's getting in the way. >> i mean, who is going to give you accurate information if you're looking like this. you're supposed to be running a country. >> unclear what that's from. 3d movie. i don't -- was he looking at the solar eclipse? >> no one else is wearing them. >> but -- >> still with us -- clearly, yeah -- this is -- >> jonathan you're our white house correspondent, what is this? >> another breakdown in intelligence that we don't know what he's wearing right here, maybe this is some sort of state-of-the-art russian equipment. he seems to be gazing at some sort of demonstration. as mika notes correctly no one else is wearing them. maybe for his eyes only. maybe it's the highest level of state-of-the-art russian intelligence technology. >> it could be like tony starks'

glasses, right. he puts on the glasses and nobody knows what tony issing me. >> -- is seeing. >> it's possible. >> here it's opposite. i guess he -- what is it? >> he was at the science exhibition in siberia. he's the only one who gets to see with these glass snooze or he's looking at the intel and can't see it. here's what the biden administration had to say yesterday. >> being lied to. >> take a look. >> it, understandably, would be an issue of concern if, for not just european allies and partners, but certainly for ukraine, if mr. putin is misinformed or uninformed about what's going on inside ukraine. it's his military. it's his war. he chose it. and so the fact that he may not

have all the context, he may not fully understand the degree to which his forces are failing in ukraine, that's little discomforting. >> one of the achilles heels of autocracies, you don't have people in that system who speak truth to power or have the ability to speak truth to power i think that is something we're seeing in russia. >> all right. joining us now, distinguished fellow and president emerit at the wilson center, former congresswoman jane harman of california and mark, a 26-year veteran of the cia serving in iraq and afghanistan and one of the agencies most decorated field officers. >> mark, i'm glad you're here today for so many reasons, but you're perfect with your background to explain exactly what not only the u.s. intel agencies are doing, but also what the brits are doing, sort

of a si-ops operation in the form of the truth. the secretary of state, oh, it's too bad, they're lying to putin. we have guys inside that have been telling us stuff from the very beginning, they're lying and then, you know, he's in algiers doing that and then the pentagon spokesman, what an insult, going, yeah, unfortunately, it's dangerous because everybody around vladimir putin are lying to him because they're afraid to tell him the truth. he doesn't even know and goes on. so explain what's going on here? >> so this is, you know, classic information operation and remember this is something we do very well. when you walk into cia headquarters on the left a biblical verse, you shall know the truth and the truth shall make you free. this is promulgating the truth and that is important because that's going to be our key super power. ultimately this is a coordinated campaign through the national security council and with our allies. but i think it's done for two reasons. one to get into putin's head, no

doubt about that. it's to sow dissension within his security elite, the foundation of his regime, but number two, and, you know, i think we've talked on this show about off ramps and, you know, i think, joe, you know that's something i'm not in favor of because a lot of us think it has to do with appeasement, but what an off ramp this would be that we're serving putin on a silver platter, he could say to the russian people my military and intelligence services have deceived me. i think that is a goal of this information operation. i don't know if it's going to work, but it really is brilliant. at the end of the day how we're using the -- not elite, authorized disclosures, it's revolutionary. >> mark, to the extent you're able to talk about it on national television, just broadly, what exactly do you suspect the cia and other international intelligence agencies are doing to get this close to vladimir putin? how does it work? >> sure. so, you know, you just -- dissemination mechanisms are

varied. it can be extending this in through vpns. russia is closed down. it's sending it in to russian officials posted overseas and, of course, to openly into the media like they're doing because we know the russian government does follow this. remember, you know, the truth at the end of the day is going to win out and, you know, this kind of sustained campaign is going to get through. russia is not like north korea yet. we still can get information in. but this is really important. and, you know, at the end of the day, you know, this is going to drive putin crazy. if he was watching this program right now even as you know we're trolling him about his goggles, it would drive him nuts. >> jane, you can mention the goggles if you want, but i want to get you to way in and take a 30,000 foot view, in terms of it seems like the intelligence pressure is just the next piece of the puzzle that west is trying to put on putin here. we're seeing the ukrainian forces have real success pushing back the russian aggression.

we know about the economic sanctions. now we're hearing about the intelligence pressure. it seems like it's a pretty carefully orchestrated plan to undermine the confidence that putin has in his military, but also the russians and the russian elites have in putin. >> let me weigh in on the glasses first. i remember that joe biden gave a pair of his signature aviators to putin. i think putin had a bad glasses day. >> should have worn those. >> that would have been sweet. but back to this, you bet, that's exactly what we're doing. we have seen a bad movie in the united states, to be fair. let's remember, the intel on the weapon of mass destruction in iraq. we learned later that saddam hussein was deceived by his intelligence and military folks who told him he had weapons of mass destruction because they were afraid he would murder them if it came out they didn't. then, our intelligence agencies at the time and vice president

cheney at the time, i wrote a book about this, decided to use this issue of wmd as a hook to get many of us, including me, to believe that russia had weapons of mass destruction and intended to attack us. >> that was bad intel. we set up the director of a national intelligence on a bipartisan basis, just imagine, in 2004 and we have good intel now and we're using it brilliantly. i don't know who made the decision to put our intel out. we have seldom done this. but not only is it good intel but putting it out, yes, is trying putin's mind, i believe, but also, i'm just guessing, that a lot of the money that he thought was being spent on military modernization, has bought all those yachts that his plutocrats. not only was he misled about the facts, but he was misled about where the money that he thought was going to modernization and

state-of-the-art stuff was going. >> we want to bring in former nfc director for european affairs, an executive board member for the renewed democracy initiative, retired colonel alexander vinman. good to have you on board. one thing we haven't touched on as much but is ongoing, the horror still being committed in a ukraine. filtration camps, cities decimated and this claim by russia they would draw back, ultimately appearing to be not true at all. does that complicate things moving forward and had ukraine been a member of nato, would this be happening? >> well, i think we're potentially facing a dangerous phase in this operation where russia may get more focused on limited objectives. that doesn't seem to be the case yet. there is some draw down of forces around western ukraine, not much around eastern ukraine, not much around kharkiv.

if they do decide to move in that direction, they could focus their efforts on the eastern portion of ukraine and achieve some gains. they don't seem completely ready to do that. they don't want to give up on their wishful thinking about achieving some military objectives. but this could be -- could get dangerous for the joint forces that are operating around the border of this luhansk and donestk regions and that could be a significant game. with regards to joining nato that would be a high bar for russia. russia would not have taken action if ukraine was inside nato. there was a reluctance of our ally, france and germany, to move in that direction and after the bucharest summit. we find ourselves here now with ukraine under attack. >> let me ask you about as you said the strategy moving forward. from what you see, does it look like putin probably is -- and

also if you listen to the propaganda coming out of the kremlin -- does it seem they are going to plan b, which is consolidate something gains in donbas and some of the other regions close to the russian border and claiming that was their, you know, their goal all along to demilitarize large parts of ukraine and consolidating gains close to the border and declares victory and goes home? >> i think that there's no real indication that russians are drawing down in a sufficient enough ways to achieve those military goals in the east. i think if they were wise they would try to do this in phases. the first phase would be achieving some gains in the east. then start going after cities like kharkiv close to russia's border and try to go for the, you know, full grab of all of

ukraine's territory. i don't believe that the limited objectives -- i wrote about this in my foreign affairs piece, the case of a limited scenario -- the cost that russia has borne don't justify this. i think if he's successful in the east, there's a good chance he pushes further along and goes for his maximalist objective. he needs more resources and needs to start -- there are conscript call ups twice a year. one that's about to unfold that's going to result in another 100,000 troops that need to get trained but they make it for a summer offensive. i think that's a hazard. i think there's a hazard about conscripts being called up and reserves and this being -- this getting drawn out into a very, very long campaign, especially if ukraine doesn't have the resources it needs to punish the russian military and just block all of its -- the military from achieving political -- the

political aims. >> so mark, your latest piece for "the washington examiner" is why spies and veterans want to do more for ukraine. you write, the war in ukraine has garnered extraordinary emotions among many veterans of the u.s. intelligence and military communities. this is is a conflict we can help our friends prevail. there's a great sense of joined moral clarity and military purpose. ukrainians fight defending their homeland and subject to horrific atrocities but never take a knee. later, president volodymyr zelenskyy is a winston churchhill like figure, inspiring from the front, his phrase, i don't need a ride, i need ammo, was brilliant on so many levels. it inspired ukraine, inspired the world, it inspired americans, it made us think of ukraine as texas and mariupol as the alamo. i speak with many of my retired

colleagues on a daily basis as one of my closest friends told me recently, we are all ukrainians now and we want to be with them. very powerful words. >> mark, what else do we need to be doing? >> so, you know, first of all, just in -- my phone blows up every day because there's this moral clarity on this crisis we didn't have. i spent almost two years in iraq and afghanistan, iraq we went in under the false premise of wmd and then in terms of afghanistan, i was there twice, once for a year running a base on the east and, you know, it was certainly justifiable, but in the end we stayed too long. that was -- there was a lot of ambiguity, friends killed, indigenous partners killed. we have this moral clarity and we want to win. i think that's extraordinary. i used to tell the young officers when running european and eurasia operations as they went into europe you have the opportunity to either witness history or perhaps to make history. what an incredible time. in terms of what we should be doing more is consistency. i see it as, you know, what's

happening in the military to military or intel to intel channels. what the do ukrainians need. there's a lot of theater and when president zelenskyy comes out and asks for things, but needs based assessments from our professionals on the ground. keep pushing that forward and keep forward on a consistent basis. i think the american people should be proud the ukrainians are doing a spectacular job and we're really helping out. >> colonel vinman, let's talk about the ukrainian people, people you know very well. for all our talk about the failure of the military effort by russia the disaster feels like it's on the ukrainian side from a humanitarian point of view their lives have been up ended, many killed, 4 million forced out of the country, many more than that displaced as they try to find safety in the face of this invasion. the world as mark just said has been so moved and so impressed by the ukrainian people, by the ukrainian leadership. how are they holding up by and large through all this? >> there's a great deal of

anxiety. i speak to folks there on a daily basis. they don't think this is anywhere near done. they're taking -- that's one of the biggest intelligence gaps for the u.s. side, is how well the ukrainian forces are holding pup they're doing a superbly well in battle but taking losses. losses in artillery and that's a particularly painful loss because that's how a lot of casualties on the russian side get inflicted. they need to be resupplied. back to the question of what they need. as they start losing their most valuable capabilities, long range fires, they need to be resupplied. there are a lot of assets that the eastern europeans, central europeans have, from their legacy of being part of the warsaw pact. those pieces of equipment should be transferred over, long range fires, unmanned aerial vehicles. we keep talking about the fact that it takes lead time to train up on western systems, but we know this war is going to last

weeks and months. it would have been great if we started training the ukrainian forces to operate some of this advanced capability about four or five weeks ago, but now it's not too late. if this is going to play out over weeks and months we could get the ukrainians ready to use these pieces of equipment. frankly, the u.s. needs to send a signal that the gates are open for equipment. if ukraine is asking for it and the eastern europeans have it it should be on offer. that will enable the ukrainians to continue to really do what's decisive here, win the war on the ground, that's how this gets settled in the first phase, compel putin to engage in negotiations. if it's near parody, if the russians still think they can achieve objectives in ukraine they're going to keep pressing and this is going to be a protracted war. this needs to be won decisively on the ground with our help. >> that moral clarity, many experts say is sort of the driving strength of the

ukrainian military and is the core of the problem for the russians because they don't have it. they have a lot of confusion as to what exactly they're fighting for. jane harman, we -- we're remembering madeleine albright this week. >> yeah. >> in many different ways as the war drags on. and in many different ways, she has been warning us about a moment just like this. >> for a very long time. she and i were on the maydon in kyiv in 2014, just after a young group of grave people toppled the russian puppet heading ukraine and we were observers at the first free and fair election in ukraine which elected poroshenko replaced by zelenskyy. but at any rate, she led our delegation and she was magical. i would like to add one thing to the prior conversation. here it is. i was just in doha, qatar, at

the doha forum, the major security conference in the middle east, and just so we are thinking about this, many leaders in the middle east who did not support the general -- general assembly resolution at the u.n., abstained as did many countries in africa, wonder why we're not caring about other hot spots in the world. why we didn't care or care enough about aleppo, which was trashed in syria or why we don't care enough about this horrible civil war in yemen or don't care about other similar awful things going on in africa. and why i raise this is, we have to be thinking about the day after. this will end somehow, but we have to rebuild, build back better, build better, this world order that was well done after world war ii, but started unraveling after the end of the cold war, because we declared ourselves the indispensable power, a phrase madelin used,

and didn't think ahead about what china could be or what terrorism could be or this sense of russian grievance. so it is really crucial, before we end up in another cold war or another world hot war, for us to pull together and think just beyond the borders of europe. not that i'm discounting anything that was said, but it's a big world and a lot of people are watching this. >> former congresswoman jane harman, retired u.s. army lieutenant colonel alexander vinman and cia veteran mark polymaropliss, thank you for being with us. >> great conversation. willie, there's clarification here. i have to make a clarification. richard haas got confused and called me during the show. we have -- we have clarification, he was actually reaching out to angela merkel, and i just found this out -- >> come on -- >> this is disappointing. he has me saved in his phone as

steve erkle. he accidentally dialed steve erkle instill of angela merckle. >> i want to know why he's face timing my husband. >> he thoughts of angela merkel. it's afternoon over there. let's bring him in here. president of the council on foreign relations and author of the book "the world, a brief introduction," richard haas. richard, thank you so much for being with us and, you know, i'm sorry we had that misunderstanding about the phone. how are you doing this morning? >> i think my next book will be "face time, a brief introduction." what do you think? >> yeah. >> as long as it comes with -- >> for the old folk. >> old folks. as long as it comes with barbecuing tips. that's what was missing from your last book. i'm curious, you've been obviously listening to some of what's going on this morning and i thought that mark, our former

cia agent, put it brilliantly, that this is just classic ops, warfare that the united states is engaging in against vladimir putin and what makes it effective they're using the truth. talk about how much putin is being lied to and actually the dangers of that and the opportunities in that? >> two sides to. it one is we really have from this crisis from the beginning really used intelligence in a creative, offensive way. not simply to inform ourselves about the other side's intentions but to anticipate them and to get into their decision loop, their implementation loop. i think that's been a really, really interesting, and again, creative tool of national security. in terms of putin, yes, he's isolated and paranoid and

created a culture -- i was kidding, i did a thing on twitter before about the expression, shoot the messengers, not just an expression there. if you deliver bad news, if you speak truth to power, then truth becomes a weapon and then you become a threat. and so i think he's created a decision making environment where people are, for good reason, frightened to deliver bad news, plus to some extent they're probably complicit. there's a degree obviously -- a significant degrees of corruption in how military rubles have been siphoned off into personal bank accounts. nobody is in a position in some ways to be straight with everybody else. that, in part, explains this fiasco from the russian point of view, the one war they're able to conduct is the standoff war, using missiles, against undefended ukrainian citizens, civilians and cities. but the military war, that's the war they're losing badly. >> finally, richard, let's talk quickly about china.

is china going to ever have to make a decision? we at had a meeting with lavrov and china i believe their foreign minister and right now they seem to be just standing right in the middle of the road, not -- i mean, their words obviously are more are pro-kremlin and yet actions, again, seem to still be trying to have it both ways. >> 100% right. they're straddling as is india and a lot of the world. the chinese don't want to distance themselves from their fellow autocracy, they don't want to admit in any way they got it wrong. on the other hand, they don't want to get caught up in secondary sanctions. they don't want to make a bad u.s.-chinese relationship worse. my guess is they're going to continue to straddle this to basically avoid coming down clearly on one side or the other. they can't wait for this to end, though. xi jinping has one priority for 2022 it's to get his third term as president. this does not help him.

>> and richard, finally, one more thing, remind mess what we're talking about autocracy, you all put out on your cover several years ago, great article, "rise of auto crates." it's not been a good year for auto crates. 2022 has been a devastating year for the au to crates if you look at putin and xi. they are stel struggling to get out of the covid crisis, struggling to restart their economy, they're still shutting down major cities. look at the problems they've been having over the past year, it's -- this has been history seems to be turning quickly against the auto crates right now. that can, of course, change again, just as quickly as it turned in this direction. talk about how autocracy is back

on its heels right now. of course we see that, of course, autocracy leads to tyrants getting bad information about wars. >> the russians obviously have made all sorts of mistakes with the war. china, as you know, is still feeling the effects of the one child policy. the demography is shrinking and aging. they've mishandled covid. one of the shortxlgs of the authoritarian systems they can't correct mistakes. they don't have the mechanisms for getting the right information and self-correcting. it's one of the advantages of democracy. we might be at a period where both sides, autocracies are dodd badly and we're not doing great as a democracy. we didn't necessarily handle inflation right. we've had problems with covid and our political division. governance on both sides, ironically enough, seems to be faltering. we're still in an era of so-called democratic back slide. governments, no matter what

their type, seem to have real trouble performing. >> all right. >> richard thank you very much. >> thank you. >> a majority of more than 4 million ukrainian refugees are living in poland right now. nbc news correspondent josh slaughterman is there with the latest on the situation plus a one-on-one interview with ambassador cindy mccain. what her late husband would think of putin's actions in ukraine. what's the situation there? >> well, mika, ambassador mccain wrapped up a visit to the border where she was able to see a world food program warehouse and to tour it with local officials, along with folks from world central kitchen, but she also had a chance to see a refugee site near the border. i asked her, what's really keeping her up at night right now, as she is dealing with this humanitarian crisis in her local role as ambassador to the u.n. agencies for food and agriculture, and i have to tell you, she was very alarmed by

this looming food shortage that is going to result, according to experts, from the lack of food, wheat and other products from russia and ukraine, the bread baskets for so many countries particularly in north africa and ethiopia, she said we're going to be in a situation where we have to choose to take food from a hungry child to give it to a starving one. she said that's what we're up against and while they're trying to find other sources of food to pick up the slack, she could not tell me right now whether that's going to be possible. of course, i also asked her about her late husband senator john mccain, who was revered in ukraine for his staunch defense of its sovereignty and one of the most outspoken critics for decades of president putin and russian au tock skrasy, i wanted to know what she thought her husband would be saying about this war if he were alive right now. this is what she said. >> your husband was revered in ukraine and an outspoken voice

against president putin and russian autocracy. now we have a russian war spiraling out of control. what do you think he would be saying about this? >> he would be screaming at the top of his lungs, are you kidding? he was such a good friend to ukraine and had so much empathy and also so much understanding for the fledgling democracy the way it was, and he called putin for what he was early on. i mean, we all remember him saying, you know, what he thought of vladimir putin. he was right. so, you know, i'm -- for many reasons i wish he were here and this is one of them. >> yeah. >> we could use his voice right now. >> i also asked ambassador mccain about what the solutions are to this food crisis, and she said look, we need every solution, including new technology, innovative planting methods to increase crop production. she said there's one way that we can make sure that this food crisis does not hit hungry people all over the world. that is for president putin to

stop the bombing and end this war. mika? >> nbc's josh letterman, thank you very much for that report. still ahead on "morning joe," former u.s. ambassador to the u.n., samantha power, will be our guest with more insight on the growing humanitarian crisis in ukraine. also ahead, nato's secretary general is staying in that role for an extra year to help steer the alliance through this turbulent period. he joins us live in our next hour of "morning joe." >> vladimir putin is a thug and a murderer and a killer and a kgb agent. he had boris nemtsov murdered in the shadow of the kremlin. he has dismembered the ukraine. precision strikes by russian aircraft on hospitals in aleppo. let's call vladimir putin for what he is. for what he is.

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welcome back to "morning joe." joining us now administrator of the united states agency for international development, samantha power. ambassador power, good morning, good to see you. you've been over to the border with ukraine a couple of times right te dawn of the war in those early days and again last weekend with president biden. you've seen with your own eyes what's happening as more than 4 million refugees stream out of that country. in the course of your diplomatic career you've been to difficult places. tell us what you saw over there and what america needs to do further here. >> well, you're right that i've traveled twice and so got to see a little bit of the early chaos as people kind of crushed up against the border and had to wait three, four days even to get into neighboring countries. now that system is much better organized. there are people to greet them. they are taken to someone's home. but the inn is filling up you

might say. people have been so generous opening up their homes and they've -- they are starting to run out of room in the big cities in a country like poland that has taken 2.5 million ukrainian refugees so far. that's one dimension of it. mainly, of course, women and children as people have heard and that creates new challenges. okay. i want to work, i have a work permit, the eu has been gracious enough to, you know, change all the rules and make it possible for people fleeing to work and get benefits, but if i work what happens to my three kids. there's no husband no father to rely upon, no community to fall back on by and large, so that's for the refugees inside europe. and then, of course, inside ukraine, further inside europe you might say, the number one issue really is the besieged areas and the fact that president putin and his forces are not allowing food, medicine,

fuel and at the same time shelling to smith ther renes. 82 attacks on hospital facilities, more than 500 on educational facilities, and again, that ensircment and attempt to use civilians and their pain and starvation, to try to extract surrenders. so far it's not working, but it puts an enormous amount of pressure on political leaders who, of course, want to defend the territory but at the same time are seeing their people experiencing suffering that we haven't seen, you know, since world war ii. >> president biden as you know has rallied the west, whether it's on economic sanctions that have crippled the russian economy, getting military equipment in to ukraine to help them fight russia, what about on the humanitarian side? what does that effort look like from the united states point view of and what's still out there for us to do there? >> well, i want to stress again,

there's assistance and then pressure and policy. on the assistance front, while president biden was in europe he announced a preparation on the u.s. part to provide a billion dollars in humanitarian assistance. we've already expended hundreds of millions to organizations like the world food program, unhcr and others, but a billion dollars is going to be a lot of resources. the key, again, though is not just how much food do we have, medicine is stockpiled on that score i think we're in a decent place, the key is, how do we get these brutal russian forces to let that food in to people who need it and that is where diplomatic pressure, the full-court press along the lines we've seen for the sanctions and for the condemnations and isolating russia, we now need something comparable where everywhere a russian official goes ir representative of who they took to, whether it's a friend or a partner like china, whether it's a country like

india, whether it's gulf states where relationship, you know, continues in certain ways, every single one of those phone calls needs to involve someone saying, let the food in, let the medicine in. not just a generic global call for that, but specific diplomacy oriented around these besieged areas. >> i know you spent some time with my brother and members of the u.s. military who are trying to create an environment for the hundreds of thousands, millions of people amassed at the border. can you explain what that entails? what you saw? >> well, first of all, let me just say as an american citizen, also an immigrant to this country how just amazing it is to see your brother, mark, in action to have an american ambassador to poland speaking fluent polish, talking to officials and families who are

hosting ukrainians in their native tongue. it's the best we can present. the best -- >> thank you. >> ambassadorial face that we can offer. and i think it's been amazing to see the u.s./polish partnership, which has always been strong, but the ways in which it has now manifested in this show of solidarity toward ukrainians in their greatest hour of need. with regard to the military, they're mainly there as you know in a show of assurance and deterrence, and so this is a humanitarian operation that is actually distinctly and discreetly humanitarian, where anything in the security space is in its own channel and it's very important we not mix those and that's something, again, ambassador brzezinski has pushed hard on as well. you see all dimensions of u.s. foreign policy and all dimensions of policy in those frontline states being brought to bear from the social services and the education, to actually needing to be in a position to

be sure that there's sufficient readiness because, of course, putin has proven himself, you know, not exactly acting in the interest of his own people. >> ambassador power, good morning. it's jonathan lamere. much has been noted about the ripple effects from this war on the rest of the globe, a lot on energy and energy prices. but there's growing concerns about a lack of food, because ukraine and russia, bread baskets of much of europe and beyond, what's to -- how concerned are you about food scarcity? there's reports that it might be the greatest since world war ii. what can be done about it? >> who's going to be impacted and how can we help? >> thanks. first on the state of play, it's grim. i mean, just to give you one example, 85% of egypt's grains come from ukraine. 81% of lebanon's grains come from ukraine. and this plays itself out around the world ahead of the imf, the

first week of the invasion said something memorable and important which is, war in ukraine, means hunger in africa. and we're already seeing that. i've had meetings with people in charge of the kinds of innovations or try to get those kind of drought resistant seeds and greater crop production going at a faster pace. i have meetings this week to try to push that agenda. but we also need those countries that have large grain reserves to release those reserves on the global market. it's almost analogous to the debates about fuel prices, who can release more reserves so there's more supply so the prices go down. every dollar now is because the prices are skyrocketing, not only in terms of fuel, not only in terms of fertilizer, but in terms of the grains themselves that means that a dollar is going to buy much less when it comes to humanitarian assistance, but also that farmers who used to be able to count on being able to buy x amount of fertilizer, can now buy a third of that.

we're already seeing actually riots where farmers are demanding government subsidies to help support them as these prices are spiraling upwards. again, everything is connected to everything else. global stability turns on a certain amount of food being in the ecosystem and so we need to look at humanitarian assistance as a stop gap, but we again need more supply on the market and those of us who do produce, bringing that to bear to try to ameliorate the situation. >> administrator for the united states agency for international development, usaid, samantha power, thank you for being on this morning. i appreciate everything you're doing. >> thank you. coming up, how nato is sizing up the war in ukraine. the alliance's secretary general joins us live, straight ahead on "morning joe."

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i was sickened, i was sickened by the standing ovation. i felt like hollywood is spineless en masse. it really felt like, oh, this is a really clear cakes, that we're not the cool club anymore. >> that's the first thing he said was, i am so sorry. why are you apologizing? it was supposed to be your night. you, amy, you regina, you all do a good job. i'm so sorry, this is going to be about this because that to me who chris s. it was sickening. i physically felt ill and i'm still a little traumatized by it. >> me too, me too. >> yes, because and for them to let me stay in that room and enjoy the rest of the show and accept his award, i was like, how gross is this? this is just the wrong message. you know, like you assault

somebody, you get escorted out the building. that's it. but for them to let him continue, i thought it was gross. >> first jim carey and wanda psyches, an oscar co-host telling her reaction. it was chris rock who apologized to wanda, not will smith. nbc news national correspondent miguel almaguer has more on potential discipline for smith and on chris rock's new stand-up show last night. >> reporter: coming out to a double-standing ovation, chris rock broke his silence, addressing the elephant in the room right off the back. >> chris, are you ready? >> reporter: in an audio recording released by "variety," rock said he wasn't yet ready to weigh into the controversy. >> so if you came to hear that, i'm not -- i had like a whole

show i wrote before this weekend. and i'm staying bit and i'm still kind of processing what happened. >> reporter: cheered on loudly by adoring fans, the warm welcome signaled a triumphant return. rock emotional saying his eyes were misty, though, he was briefly interrupted by someone in the crowd. most of the audience thrilled to see rock bouncing back. >> he handled his first incident after that. >> reporter: now in the ug my aftermath, a new bombshell, the academy says will smith was asked to leave sunday's award show but refused. oscar co-host wanda psyches telling ellen she still feels traumatized by what happened and the academy allowing smith to stay. >> you you a sault somebody, you get escorted out the building and that's it. you know, but for them to let

him continue, i thought it was gross. >> reporter: ellen also a former host agreed. >> you don't let someone do something like that, get away with that and be awarded. >> reporter: more hollywood drama was unfolding in los angeles, where the academy's board of governors initiated dispalestinianary procedures against -- disciplinary procedures against will myth for inappropriate conduct, abuse i or threatening behavior and compromising the integrity of the academy. >> will smith just smacked the shit out of me. >> reporter: they apologized, adds, thank you for your resilience in that moment. but this morning, rock is still not sharing details, but promising he will. promising he will. . >> miguel almaguer reporting there. joining us, founding partner at puck, mathieu bellany, you are a great person to have here, not

just because of your insights into the entertainment industry. but you were in the room on sunday night. you watched all this play out be with your own eyes, which had to be an extraordinary spect cam. the academy says they tried to escort will smith out of the building. he refused to leave. did you see that happening? did security guards come over to get him out? what did that look like? >> absolutely not. that's the issue right now s. what exactly does that mean that we asked him to leave? and he refused. because from every indication we are getting, it wasn't that force. it was probably a comment through his publicist to hey, would will think about leaving? we don't believe it was a forceful thing. there were certainly no security guards. he did have a conversation with will packer, who is the producer of the oscar's telecast. we don't believe it was a force. , you must leave right now. >> yeah, i was glad you seen

that, i talked to people, they said they didn't see any evidence of people getting him out of the room. what was it like to witness this with your own eyes? watching on tv, it was truly hard to believe in that okay, they're doing a bit. they added sound to make that sound like a real smack until they cut to will smith with the audio dropped out, mouthing words that will smith would not be yelling at the academy awards if it were a bit. what was it like to be in the room? >> it was deafeningly silent after he started yelling. are you right. we thought this is a bit. these are guys that are pros, they know each opts. once he started screaming, you knew will smith would never act that way and no one knew how to respond. that's the crazy thing here is everyone is coming down in hollywood for it, a standing ovation. the host didn't come out and explain what is going on. there was no stopping of the show and coming on, producers

tell us. so we kientd of chugged along of that incident. he was still sitting there. it was the craziest thing. he was sitting there in front of the audience as we were all like looking around, not paying attention to the show, saying, what itself going to happen here? >> yeah, before you founded puck, you were an editor at the hollywood reporter. so you are very plugged in. i am curious to get your sense how hollywood is reacting? my initial sense shocked me a little bit, it was i would say majority defense of will smith within hollywood among actors and other people who were defending him until we saw major names like jim carey a couple days ago, we heard from ellen yesterday. what is your sense where hollywood has come down on this? >> i think it was initially split. people were defending him. as the days have gone on and we sort of realized the implications of what happened

and the embarrassment that this event has brought upon the oscars, i think there is a lot of anger in community. there is a real sense that something has to be done. there needs to be a significant punishment, both to prevent will smith from doing this again, comediennes are afraid that he can himers are now going to jump up on stage and attack and feel emboldened. i don't blame them. unless the academy comes down very hard on him, it sends a horrible message. >> real quick, mathew, before i let you go, what does that look like? they will not take his oscar, harvey weinstein has his oscar, so what does big punishment look like the academy? >> i think there is a suspension. there is a continuum of people that want to expel him. i think you are looking at a significant, significant suspension and ineligibility from oscar voting for a year, maybe two years.

>> from oscar voting. all right. mathew bellany, great to talk with you with puck. thanks so much, mika. up next, the latest from on the ground in ukraine. russia stems up attacks in some areas despite vowing to scale back troops. and nato's secretary general joins us in just a few minutes, to discuss the international response to the ongoing war. we are back in 90 seconds. we gotta tell people that liberty mutual customizes car insurance so you only pay for what you need, and we gotta do it fast. [limu emu squawks] woo! new personal record, limu! only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty. ♪ this is xfinity rewards.

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. understandably, it would be an issue of concern if for not just our european allies and partners, certainly for ukraine. if mr. putin is misinformed or uninformed about what's going on inside ukraine. it's his military. it's his war. he chose it. and so the fact that he may not have all the context that he may not fully understand that agree to which his forces are failing in ukraine. that's a little discomforting. >> one of the achilles heels of autocracies is you don't have people in power that speak truth to power. i think that is something we are seeing in russia. >> u.s. intelligence officials determined vladimir putin is being misinformed by his

advisors about russia's military struggles in ukraine. that comes as ukraine's president says the russian invasion has reached a turning points n. a televised address, zelenskyy said there is an ongoing negotiation process with russia. added, quote, these are still just words. moscow steps up attacks near kiev and other areas of ukraine, despite vowing to scale back its offensive. chief correspondent richard engel has the latest on the ground. >> reporter: in the outskirt, we traveled to see what u.s. and british intelligence to say russian generals are too afraid to show their president, the russian military is losing ground and taking heavy losses. this was a russian camp. you can see they had all of their weapons here, duckout positions and they were bombed. there is still some bodies in

this area and they left a lot of their equipment behind after what appears to have been a devastating attack on their position. there is nothing left. it seems these russian troops never knew what hit them. their uniforms were scattered everywhere, along with weapons and ammunition. ukrainian soldiers helped themselves. knocking out this position, allowed ukrainian forces to advance and take back the nearby village where this family was enjoying their new freedom on the first day after russian soldiers were kicked out. the bombings were horrible. the air strikes were the worse, she says. they took to us see where they had been hiding. no electricity or lights. let's see. they live down in this tiny cellar for 27 days, next to potatoes and pickles. do you think the worse is the over? >> i hope our soldiers tame this beast. the russian president is

deranged. he says, his granddaughter spent her time drawing on the walls. images of happier times. it was my therapy to keep calm, she says. wise words from a girl who just turned 8. now she's drawing with her chalk outside. down the road, 88-year-old presscovia was sitting by herself, disoriented and frightened. i am so afraid. my whole body is shaking, she says, at night i cover myself with a blanket and i shake, mostly, she wanted comfort. she lived through world war ii and says she doesn't have the strength to go through it all again. oh, my god. >> and this morning, the nato secretary general said their intelligence shows that russian troops are not withdrawing but repositioning and warn that the world can expect additional

russian offensives. and that to secretary general yen stoltenberg joins us right now. sir, i'd like to start by asking you what the alliance can do as a whole to save the lives of europe and ultimately the alliance, itself? and are humanitarian zones even a possibility in the future? i know you are staying on an extra year to work on this? >> reporter: so fundamentally, nato does two things. we provide support to ukraine, military support to our allies, provide them modern military equipment. mostly humanitarian and financial support to ukraine. our close partner. then our course is to make sure all nato allies 1 billion people stay safe and secure in this more dangerous security and reality which we face now.

therefore, we have significantly increased our major presence in the eastern alliance and very much with the leading role of the united states and administration in accepting in more troops and european allies stepped up with more troops oak, at sea and the air and our greatness to protect and defend every inch of nato territory. >> you called ukraine a valuable partner. ukraine's valiant defense against this russian assault, does it demonstrate that the nation perhaps is more than ready to take on the responsibility of nato membership? and had this been a member, would this be happening? >> first of all, it demonstrates to the courage of the ukrainian armed forces the courage of the ukrainian people and the ukrainian political leadership, and president zelenskyy's leadership and the ukrainian people have inspired the whole

world. nato has made it clear that nato's door is opened, but, of course, when it comes to ukraine now, the main focus is provide them support, is to help them, as we have done for many, many years. we have helped to train nato allies and tens of thousands of ukrainian troops which are now on the front line fighting, invaing russian forces, ukrainian armed forces are better trained, better equipped, better led and much bigger than ever before. this has proven extremely important in resisting invading russian forces. what we see is russia continues to pursue a military solution to the conflict in ukraine. >> mr. secretary general, let's take a step back in that to and look what's happened over the past few months generally. i am curious if you had any time at all to think about the historic changes that have taken

place and the more muck lar role nato and european countries individually now are talking about taking in the future? i am also curious about finland, curious about sweden, do we expect the possibility of their membership in nato in the future? >> well, the discussion taking place in finland and sweden now. i listed finland and sweden and the political contact with the leadership in the two countries. our message is that every independent sovereign nation asks sweden and finland, how to choose. we have for many years respected their decision no not aspire for nato membership. but if they decide to change in light of the brutal nation of ukraine and then, of course, we also respect that. and what we know is that finland and sweden, they meet the nato

standard. we have operate aektability and we train together, therefore, i expect they will be very much welcomed and allies and that we can find a ways to welcome them into nato through a quick process. but this is at the end of the day for finland and sweden to decide whether to apply and for the other allies to decide on a way forward. >> mr. secretary general, good morning. thank you for being with us today. there are clear red lines that you have drawn, president biden has drawn, for example, no-fly zone established over ukraine, because that would lead to russian planes and nato planes getting into fights and perhaps shot down and escalating this crisis. you said that's a non-starter. but are there lines that russia could cross within the boundaries of ukraine that would draw in nato troops? would it be the use of chemical weapons or tactical nuclear weapons, something like that,

that would change your thinking whether or not nato troops should be introduced inside ukraine? >> nato's core and most important responsibility is to protect and defend 30 nato allied countries. we do that by sending in a clear message to russia, moscow, if they attack any nato countries in the same way they have attacked ukraine, we will be there all allies to protect the ally which is attacked. so it's a one for all and all for all. it's the core principle of nato at all times. that's our core responsibility and we have reenforced our presence to ensure any misunderstanding to do that to prevent an attack. when it comes to ukraine, we support them. any use of chemical weapons will totally change the nature of

that conflict. it will be a blatant violation of international law. it will have widespread consequences and, of course, that's the reason why it's so important to end this war as soon as possible. because it is a dangerous war. we have to make sure it doesn't spiral out of control and escalate beyond ukraine's border into any nato country. >> mr. secretary general, good morning. i wanted to get you on two things. first, your observations on the peace talks that have taken place, mixed signals. ukrainians suggest there could be some stems in the right direction. others far more skeptical saying the russians, frankly, can't be believed. on that related, a few minutes ago, the kremlin announced it is drafts over 30,000 new conscripts into the army. they say they won't go to ukraine. but can that be trusted? >> look. i have seen so many times

throughout this conflict and preparations before the conflict is russia lied again and again, about their intentions, their plans and also how they conduct war inside ukraine. we have seen the conscripts have been deployed to ukraine earlier in this conflict and, of course, kit happen again. we welcome all efforts to try to find a political solution and, of course, welcome the talks that have taken place in turkey and i want to thank turkey for facilitating those talks. what we see is russia continues its military operations. it continues to pursue a way to find a solution to this conflict and we don't actually see any withdrawal of russian forces. what you see is they are pre-positioning them. and that they are planning for a more broad offensive in the donbas region. so we had to judge them on their

actions, not on their words. we need to continue to support ukraine, to put maximum pressure on russia by sanctions and then by that, push as much as we can to have an end to this senseless award. >> mr. secretary general, there have been reports ukraine is considering abandoning its effort to join nato. is that due to nato's rejection so far or russian aggression and if it's russia, then doesn't that threaten nato's open-door policy? the values that nato is based on? >> for me, the most important thing is to say that this is for ukrain to decide, whether they aspire for nato membership or not. that's exactly the principles that we have defended. nato's open-door policy has been a great success. since the cold war, since the beginning of the 1990s. the number of members on nato

has doubled from 16 to 30. almost doubled and this has helped to spread democracy, stability, and prevent a conflict in europe in a way we haven't seen for many, many years. so, nato's open-door policy has been a success. at the same time to the member, we need to consensus in nato. we need 30 allies to agree and, therefore, our focus has been on broadening support to ukraine, respect the decision and then the most urgent need is to see what we can do to end this war. >> finally, mr. secretary general, there have been so many countries within that to that have stepped up and done extraordinary work over the last month or so i want to ask you about two countries that maintain a friendly relationship with russia that will members of nato, one, of course, hungary. the other turkey.

are you satisfied with their level of support for nato during this crisis with russia? >> well, all nato allies have united in their condemnation of the russian invasion of ukraine. we have agreed to statements. we have expressed support to ukraine. we also have continue to support ukraine in different ways. we had actually the day of the invasion, we convened with family council and we had a strong condemnation of the invasion by russia and, of course, all allies were a part of that decision. when nato met in brussels last week, patricia was there. so this is a strong, united message from nato to condemn the use of military force against a

sovereign independent nation ukraine and to provide support to ukraine. that's the message we will continue to convey as long as russia abides by the sovereign territory of the free and democratic nation in europe. >> nato secretary general, yen stoltenberg, thank you so much for being with us and all you do we greatly appreciate it. >> so although nato is united in holding russia accountable, some division seem to be growing within the european union more than a month into the war, there are disc opinions whether to cut all energy ties with russia. while most of the eu supports severing ties, countries such as germany, who are dependent on russian oil are resisting an embargo on russian energy imports and while this debate goes on, russian oil continues to flow through ukrainian pipelines. leaving the country's largest

energy company caught in the middle, natfogaz. the ceo of naftogaz. i know your company has been hit by russian missiles. you have lost several workers. we appreciate your coming on the show. what do you think would be meaning. , effective and also realistic energy sanctions against russia at this point? >> we want russian sanctions that would stop vladimir putin's regime and a full embargo is a must. it's something putin will immediately, he won't be able to debate with his soldiers and pensions to people that support him. putin gets up to $1 billion per day from exports of oil and gas. that's why a full embargo is a

must. we would say they have a mild diversion, not we but germany, for example, in countries and then at least they should think to the so-called allowance when they pay for oil and gas and putin do not get this money until he withdraws from ukraine. and they should also consider sanctions onnee owe consider some specific kerr size on all the imports of energy from russia to make sure that putin feels some reel back from these sanctions. >> yesterday, the germans announced that it's sort of encouraging their citizens to start rationing gas, to use less

gas, because they may be moving in the direction that you want them to move. do you see that as a positive sign? do you think it is possible for countries like germany to have a complete embargo? >> definitely, it's the right thing to do. to more efficiently use gas. germany was doing the opposite, unfortunately. but now, finally, they are doing the right things. they, for example, are reducing coal. they turned up their nuclear stations and increased their diplomacy on russian gas. so now finally, we understand that this diplomacy is detrimental to their security. that's why putin believes that he can kill innocent ukrainians without consequences. so now they're changing it. that includes energy efficiency.

it includes alternative supplies, treks, from the u.s. they're trying to get natural oil and gas and oil and other measures that are critical. >> and as the country's largest energy company. you serve 12 million households, what is it going to take to get through the next few months? >> kumpbtsly, we have enough gas in our storage to use enough gas. so it's a small concern for me. the real concern for me se that there are cities in ukraine that are without gas, electricity, water, critical supplies. so it's a human catastrophe over there. we are talking about again hundreds of thousands of people. that will clearly, thatly allows to sleep it a night. that's something that needs to stop right now. people are dying as we speak.

>> naftogaz, ceo, yurie shenko, thank you for coming on. still ahead on "morning joe", millions of children have been forced to leave ukraine because of the russian invasion. we will talk about the inspiring invasion to deliver them a piece of home. you are watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. e watching . we'll be right back.

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. >> the united nations now says 2.5 million children have left ukraine and are in urgent need of safety and support. now there is a grass roots effort to do just that, by sending boo, from ukraine to the countries where people have fled, nbc news' jacob soberoff has more from lviv.

>> reporter: striking missiles striking lviv saturday. >> down to our match point there, the fuel depo. >> reporter: a city shaken, but this week life continues, including for marianna, back at work as ukraine's largest publishers. back to work, not to normal. what's it been like for to you close some of your stores around the country? >> i am not happy that they close. but i know that it can be dangerous for our employees. >> reporter: now she and her colleagues have started checking humanitarian aid, the filled for essentials for kharkiv. when it's literature, she feels can can help heal the most. they launched a fundraising effort. >> people are donate something. >> reporter: yes. what they receive sends books to surrounding countries, like these children in poland, nearly 5,000 so far.

if there is one book you'd like the churn to have the most, which one is it? >> here, here. yes, i know the book in my cabinet. here's a book. >> reporter: it's called, how war changed rondo, originally published after russia ukrained in 2014. as russia attacks again as well as never. >> it says here, the war touched everyone. >> everyone. >> reporter: the book's story about kids living in a fictional place at war cauldrondo. >> it goes together to make a light. >> reporter: now real life for ukrainian churn. together we read the book's final passage, one she wishes can spread hope. >> reporter: the whole town saying in every black flower disappeared and the darkness dissolved completely. >> victory. >> reporter: victory. >> yes. >> reporter: that's what you hope for ukraine?

yes. >> nbc news' jacob soberoff reporting from ukraine. coming up next, a leading man steps out of the spotlight. an update about star actor bruce willis when "morning joe" comes right back. [sound of helicopter blades] ugh... they found me. ♪ ♪ nice suits, you guys blend right in. the world needs you back. i'm retired greg, you know this. people have their money just sitting around doing nothing... that's bad, they shouldn't do that. they're getting crushed by inflation. well, i feel for them. they're taking financial advice from memes. [baby spits out milk] i'll get my onesies®.

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centuries ago, native californians thrived on this land. now, we share a destiny with all californians. when voters granted our sovereign nations exclusive gaming rights, it advanced self-sufficiency and created thousands of good jobs. but now, out of state corporations are coming to california. their online sports betting initiative

would break the promise between us. it's bad for tribes and all californians. join us. protect the promise. welcome back. if you've seen bruce willis in action. you know he's not a frayed of a fight onscreen. but today, he's got a different type of battle on his hands. nbc news' joe fryer reports. >> reporter: known for his tough-talking onscreen persona, that iconic catchphrase, bruce willis is stepping away from the spotlight. his family says he has been recently diagnosed with aphasia,

impacting his abilities. he is stepping away from the career that has meant so much to him. adding, as bruce always said, live it up. and together we plan to do just that. willis got his break in the '80s on the small screen. >> just remember, you are dressed like that for america. and i, for one, salute you. >> salute you. >> reporter: starring alongside cybil sheff e shepard in the prime time hit "moonlighting." the time he opened up about his new-found fame on on interview on "early today." >> i never got into this business seeking fame and fortune. if anything, it makes me want top keep my private life more private. >> reporter: willis later cemented his action star status as detective john mcclain in "diehard." a role he reprised four more times. >> welcome to the party, pam. >> reporter: the beloved actor

found success in a wide range of films from can the pulp fiction." to success in "armageddon." willis has five daughter, who with wife and three with demi moore. they've remained close with moore surprising willis at his comedy central roast a few years ago. >> i just look at our marriage like the sixth scent, you were damned the whole time. no matter what, you will always be family. you have been a great friend, a great father and easily one of my top three husbands. >> reporter: earlier this month, moore shared a photo with women liss as he celebrated his 67th birthday, writing, thankful for our blended family. >> while hollywood is mourning the loss of this actor on screen, he has this support system behind the scene to really tackle this challenging

time together. >> that was nbc news' joe fryer reporting. coming up, what if everyone voted? how universal voting requiring every american to cast a ballot would impact democracy as we know it. that conversation is next on "morning joe." that conversation is next on "morning joe."

. >> you know the papers are so corrupt. the media is so corrupt. they build up a case, like we won that massively. we won many of them massively. i say we won every swing state by a lot and you are one of the people that covered it, you know exactly what i'm talking about, it was corrupt. >> kristi's tee /* chris

christie said he knew he was going to lose and started the lie. so he just started the lie then. got ahead of it. so the fact that he's again continuing to humiliate himself and really thinks that people are stupid enough to believe that, because they get their news from chinese cult religious sites, well, it shows this guy is obsessed with the past a. lot of people want to look to the future. >> that's him two days ago. >> he keeps lying. >> after two years -- >> sorry to interrupt. he keeps lying just like who, just like who?

vladimir putin. and who is he calling for help? >> yeah. >> in the middle of a war? she's asking a war criminal to help him, what does this sound like. >> like any other former president. >> he's adding a war criminal in the middle of a war that he said was genius. he said his means of invading was genius. he keeps saying what a smart guy he is. when actually he's really made some of the worst blunders on the international stage in our lifetime. but he's asking a war criminal for help. just like in 2016. he asked that same war criminal who committed war crimes in chechnya, who committed war crimes in aleppo for help, asked actually for them to go in and hack hillary clinton's e-mail account. this is the same guy when he talked to president zelenskyy, zelenskyy begging him for help. that congress had already offered him.

what did he say? i don't know, i'm not so sure. held up weapons to ukraine because he wanted to get dirt on joe biden. those two guys right there, you know, i know he's a junior partner to vladimir putin, donald trump is a junior partner to vladimir putin for some reason. we don't know exactly. it doesn't really matter. we know he's in his pocket. but, again, it's -- this actually what's happening in ukraine has been so clarifying for a lot of americans who actually used to tell pollsters they had a positive impression of vladimir putin simply because donald trump was his pawn. >> so after years of repeating these falsehoods, we're seeing it take hold in the republican party a. poll released this year shows more than half of republicans don't believe joe biden's win was legit. so how do we reverse the

cynicism of an election where the turnout reached record levels? our next guests say they have the answer. make voting mandatory. joining us now, columnist at the washington post is a government professor at georgetown university and a senior fellow in government studies at the brookings institution and senior practice follow in american democracy at the ash center for democratic governments and innovation at the harvard kennedy school. miles rapaport joins us. they are co-authors of the new book called 100% democracy. the case for universal voting. also with us for this conversation, the host of msnbc's politics nation and president of the national action noimpblth reverend al sharpton joins us. >> he says, give us the case. >> thanks for having us on. it's good to see you. our argument is twofold. one is if you assert that voting

is a universal civic duty, that is the best way to defend voting as a right. because under this system, everyone is required to vote, which means the entire system from the election laws you have to the way elections are administered is designed to make it easy for people to vote. our modem is australia, where they have to make extraordinary efforts to make it easy to vote. the second premises that our election system right now is like a fancy dinner party with an a-list of voters and b-lists and c-lists. you know it from your own campaigns. politicians and coupleants spend almost all their time focusing on an a-list of likely voters that means that efforts aren't even made to mobilize less frequent voters or to get them political information. we think and again australia has

been using this system for 100 years, we think this would change the culture of democracy in our country, where everybody embraces the right to vote. my favorite picture from australia is three surfer dudes, maybe one is a woman, so three surfer dudes and a surfer woman in a polling place, they come out to surf and go back into the surf. the last point is for anybody who thinks this is a radical idea we got a radical idea from australia a century-and-a-half ago. it was called the secret ballot. it's sometimes called the australian ballot. people thought, no, you can't have a secret ballot in america. parties used to print the ballot. we adopted it. we wouldn't think of having an election any other way. if you adopt this idea, we would see a culture we would never want to get rid of. we want this tried in states and

localities around our country. >> "the washington post" draws from the book that you both wrote, in part, the first step towards ending our voting wars is to recognize that every citizen should play a role in shaping our nation's destiny. in the wake of changes that made voting more convenient, and resulted in a record turnout in 2020, state after state is making it harder for citizens to cast a ballot. congress is deadlocked on whether the federal government should protect this most basic of all democratic rights. false claims of election rigging in 2020 led to a violent attack on the very process of transfering power. as a nation, we vacillate between inclusion and exclusion, between embracing democracy or retreating, breaking this cycle requires a game changer. we propose universal voting. under this system, every u.s. citizen would be legally obligated to vote, just as every

citizen is obligated to serve on juries by recognizing that all of us as a matter of civic duty have an obligation to shape our shared project of democratic self government, we could move from our 2020 voter turnout high to acquisition.8% of eligible voters, much closer to 100% democracy and miles pap a port, i covered you in connecticut. can you talk about, though, some of the challenges that universal voting brings to the table? >> well, yeah. first of all, i'd like to say the analogy with injury duty is very powerful for me. i think people have in our culture an understanding and acceptance you have to serve on juries as a sick duty. obviously, this sa brand-new idea in the american political context as dj says it's been in australia and 26 other democratic countries around the world for over 100 years.

you know, obviously people will resist the idea as xulgsz. we think what we can do with universal voting is to create a culture of participation. which they have done in australia, to make it clear that everyone is participating and i think if everyone is participating, then schools, employers, political campaigns will all shift themselves to the idea that we are talking to everybody, because everybody is going to participate. not just likely or prime voters. >> reverend al sharpton. >> i think that this is an absolutely necessary idea that they raise. because when you look at the fact that as they said, j irry duty, even the fact that all american citizens have to file their taxes if they have an income. why should we be obligated to vote and choose the leaders of the land and those that would be

employers or those that we have to make adjustments in terms of the workers should do so. we should see voting as an obligation. i think the thing that will really be beneficial is it knocks out all of the voting restrictions. all of the suppression methods many of us in the civil rights community are fighting. it would eliminate that automatically. we'd have a democracy paced on the maximum participation of the people in the country. everybody that graduates high school should be given a voter registration card and voting card. that's a true democracy. i think it's a brilliant idea. >> talk about the challenges that we've seen, even over the past two, three years of republicans working fairly aggressively to limit voting rights along people of color. how does -- actually, how do we get a republican president or this current group of republican

senators and congressmen, congress women, to support something like this? >> well, first, bless you, reverend al for that endorsement for the idea. we really appreciate it. we've actually found, by the way, when you start talking about this idea, people get excited about it because you're right, joe, about, you know, depending on how you count, up to 19 states are taking the system we created during the pandemic to make it easier for people to vote, and they're rolling it back. we should have looked at the 2020 election as an enormous victory for democracy because republicans and democrats and independents and libertarians and socialists, it was easier to vote for everybody, and in some states you are sort of actually rigging the law in particular ways to exclude particular groups, particularly people of color, black people, latinos, asian americans, and also young

people. our election laws are particularly difficult for young people who move around a lot more than older people. and when you look at who turns out and who doesn't, we think our system would include -- would tear down barriers of diskrim inauguration day nation against everyone. many more young people would be edge gained, many more less affluent people. and from what we can tell from the data, it would probably make the system more moderate. i know at least one republican who privately told me, i want this system because it will force my party to appeal to more moderate voters rather than relying on just the ideological base. >> the new book is "100% democracy: the case for universal voting." e.j. and miles, thank you both for being on this morning. and rev, stay with us. up next, one of our favorite bits from jimmy kimmel.

this month in covid history. as the world watches the tragedy in ukraine, oil and gas ceos see an opportunity to get richer. hiking gas prices here at home and profiting off of putin's war. this will continue to happen - as long as we're dependent on oil. americans have had enough. right now, congress can accelerate the transition to clean energy. energy that won't run out. energy that's cheaper for all of us. energy that's made in america to stay in america. congress - let's get it done. this is the new world of work.

each day looks different than the last. but whatever work becomes, the servicenow platform will make it just, flow. whether it's finding new ways to help you serve your customers, orchestrating a safe return to the office... wait. an office? what's an office? ...or solving a workplace challenge that's yet to come. wherever the new world of work takes your business, the world works with servicenow.

this month in covid history. travel with us through the ages one year ago. the new president is really stepping up. oh. whoopsie. well, have a nice trip and don't forget your vaccine passport. >> you will want to get that cdc card. that is going to be your golden ticket for 2021. >> we've got a golden ticket. or not. >> does anybody in this restaurant think it's a good idea to take the vaccine? raise your hand if you think it's a good idea. anyone here, a good idea to take the vaccine? raise your hand if you think it's a good idea. >> this has been drive-ins and

dying. now let's gather on the sidewalk box for the qanon radio hour. grab your decolder rings. q has a new message. >> donald trump will become president on march 4th. >> start spreading the ks. >> on march 4th, trump will be reinstated as president. >> trump will take office on march 4th. >> he is inaugurated on march 4th. >> you're going to feel foolish on march 59 when biden is still president. >> trump has a different plan. >> he's hoping it's a retirement plan. this has been "this month in covid history." >> crazy. rev, something you brought up, a lot of focus obviously on an assault taking place on stage during the academy awards. but that overshadowed really a big night for diversity at the

oscars. talk about that. >> you know, the national action network is talking about inclusion. and there was the #oscarsowhite. and we finally saw real diversity. will packet was the producer of the oscars, first time we had a black in that position. quest love won for documentary of what has been called the equivalent of a mass black showing like we had the showings in terms of big festivals. it was the woodstock of black america. he won an oscar for that. i was in it. i did an interview. that was all overshadowed by what will smith did to chris rock. though i have a lot of respect and regard for will, i hope he heals and recovers, but there's no way we can say that we want to see gun violence stopped in our communities and have as an example when you get angry you

go and punch somebody out on national television and overshadow real achievement in hollywood that many of us fought for. i think the unspoken tragedy is that will packet and quest love and others were overshadowed by some behavior that wasn't called for. >> i feel bad for chris rock. i still do. >> yeah. >> he was just sort of left there in a very traumatic situation. >> and everybody ran over to chris and -- i mean to will and chris is standing there the victim. >> what was that? >> yeah. i didn't get it. >> and then gave him a standing ovation. gave him a standing ovation. and the academy said, oh, we tried to get -- no. he committed battery on the stage and then gets a standing ovation from the academy a few minutes later. it's just bizarre. wanda sykes said it just seemed gross that he was allowed to stay there, get a standing ovation after he assaulted somebody.

>> well, i'm all for healing. they call for healing. but before you can heal something, you have to admit and deal with the injury, and it was very injurious. >> reverend, thank you. before we go, on this week's episode of "mika straight up," joe and willie crashed my podcast and it was a complete mess. >> terrible. >> we go to four hours on monday. that does it for thus morning -- four hours. >> do we really? >> four hours. >> really. >> chris jansing picks up the coverage right now. good morning. i'm chris jansing live at msnbc headquarters in new york. it is thursday, march 31st. we've got a lot to get to including that long-awaited interview for the house committee investigating the january 6th insurrection. former president trump's son-in-law and former white house senior adviser jared kushner today expec